Someone might mix it, somebody else might have a different combination and that is how we did it. I would be a bad scientist if I were to write down for you now that I knew exactly that they were all given in a certain manner on the third day, or that they are all like this and this now. It states expressly in Thomas' statement, of course, that any prearranged table for the administration is wrong, and that we also cannot prescribe the correct way to apply these drugs. It was obviously clear that there was a strong impression made by sulfanilamides and, even in the first group, we were astonished to find a certain result, which is useful for the idea as such, but not for practical purposes. Among other things we immediately and simultaneously sprinkled a mixture of germs together with sulfanilamide powder into the wound. That was the only exception made in the first group and it didn't produce any results at all. Now, if I were a bad scientist then I would have assumed that that, in itself, was a success. No matter whether it was the ultrasepsis or the powder we had used, I would have been satisfied, and I would have said, "Everybody now has to take a little bag of sulfanilamide along with him and powder the wounds with it immediately because we know that if they are inserted simultaneously into the wound — the germ and the drug — then there will be no inflammation." Only in complete ignorance of wound conditions and war conditions could one adopt that point of view. The disadvantage of the sulfanilamide bag is that a man who is badly shot isn't in a position to act; he would be lying somewhere badly wounded and not be able to do anything. On the other hand, of course, the position is that the surface of the wound can easily be powdered, but of course not right down to the very bottom of the wound, and we know particularly well that sulfanilamides when applied wrongly in this way have caused injury.

Q. The second group consisted of the 36 women, 3 times 12 women?

A. Yes. Infection, plus contact materials.

Q. Is it true that the Reich Physician SS, Dr. Grawitz, on 3 September 1942, when inspecting Ravensbrueck, demanded that the experimental conditions had to be made more severe in order to create conditions similar to wartime conditions?

A. At the beginning of September, on the basis of my report, I was called to Grawitz to report on the results which might be expected. Grawitz, and as I shall explain later, Stumpfegger, came to me at the beginning of September. Since Grawitz was coming to Ravensbrueck I turned up on the same day, so that Fischer could demonstrate the patients under my protection. That is the impression probably created repeatedly by the testimony of witnesses; they have to wait for a time, and then I say "These are the patients whom I operated on." I assume the same description was given each time. Grawitz was able to prove to me that the effects were circumscribed

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