NMT01-T693
Volume I · Page 693
without phenol. I am speaking of the sera for therapeutic purposes, not vaccines.
Q. Then at no time did you even propose that experiments be conducted to determine the tolerance of sera containing phenol; is that what you say?
A. No. I never suggested that.
Q. Are you sure, Doctor?
A. Yes.
Mr. Hardy: At this time, your Honor, I offer Document NO-1198 as Prosecution Exhibit 466, for identification. This is a letter dated Berlin, 21 August 1941. Subject: Service of experiments. It has reference-file indexes, addressed to the chief hygienist on the staff of the Reich Physician SS and Police, Berlin Zelhendorf:
"Dear Mrugowsky,The signature is "Nicolai".
"I am able to inform you that the Reich Leader SS has approved today the series of experiments proposed by you.
"1. Specific therapy with typhus.
"2. Tolerance of sera containing phenol.
"I agree that both series of experiments in the department for typhus and virus research of the Hygienic Institute of the Waffen SS in Weimar-Buchenwald should be carried out, and request that I be informed of the course of the findings, perhaps through intermediary reports." "By order of Grawitz."
Q. Now this states that the Reich Leader SS has approved a series of experiments proposed by you and the experiments may be carried out in Buchenwald. You stated that you never proposed experiments to determine the tolerance of sera containing phenol. Now do you maintain, Doctor, that you never initiated any experimentation to determine the tolerance of sera containing phenol?
A. Yes. The connection here is something quite different. I shall discuss point two first.
I have already said that in Germany there were no sera without phenol. in connection with this phenol question in German serum, I informed Grawitz about the question which is being discussed here — Killian and Schreiber were present — and I told him that industry should try to produce sera without phenol, as the French serum industry had been doing for some time. I knew that suggestions to that effect had been sent to the industry, but that the German serum industry had refused, during the war. to effect any such basic change in its production because it was not in a position to obtain the necessary special apparatus, filters, etc. I therefore told Grawitz that in serum therapy for ordinary diseases — I was thinking primarily of diphtheria,
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